Speaker 1: 0:01

On Monday I have a costume party for my work, which is I work remotely, so it's going to be a zoom costume party. What's your costume? I'm going to be Spider-Man. I got to. I have a going to put a green screen behind me. You can see the green screen over there, actually.

Speaker 2: 0:15

Okay.

Speaker 1: 0:16

And I'm going to turn it into a New York City. And here's my big. My big plan to hopefully win the contest is I've devised a way to turn my webcam upside down so that I can be wearing my Spider-Man costume, but come up from the bottom of the frame and it looks like I'm dropping down from the top in New York, that's. This is my big plan.

Speaker 2: 0:36

I haven't tested it.

Speaker 1: 0:37

I'll let you know how it works, but that's a big curtain that will hang behind me and then create the illusion of New York City, a place that I've never been.

Speaker 2: 0:48

That's going to be cool. You got to break that, you got to go out to New York.

Speaker 1: 0:52

I agree I would. It sounds really cool and I think this is the time of year to go to New York.

Speaker 2: 0:57

It gets better and better every year. Every year, too, it gets better and better. Like they like 10, like 15 years ago, like Union, union Street was all messed up and busy traffic and then they just like shut it down from traffic and they put all these nice like bike paths and like sitting areas all throughout it and when people proposed it, they were like that's crazy, you guys are stupid, that's crazy. And then, as soon as they did it, everyone was like how did we ever have it any other way? This is so delightful. It was just like night and day. It was totally.

Speaker 1: 1:29

It does seem like humans often have to be dragged kicking and screaming into better, like a better, better setup, while they're complaining the whole time. Why didn't we do this earlier? I'm like okay, so you still have to complain.

Speaker 2: 1:41

It's just now that you have to complain about the other thing, so I have a solution today, scott.

Speaker 1: 1:59

Okay, it's a little bit. It's a little welcome to solutions for the moment. Yes, everyone, I'm Scott Moppen.

Speaker 2: 2:04

I'm Adam Brous. We come deal with a new solution every week. This one is not really necessarily solutions. It's more like an invention. Inventions from the multiverse. I like it. It's still going to be a solution, though, in some ways, because you'll see, you'll see. You'll see, as a podcast producer especially, you're the expert, actually You're the expert in this episode.

Speaker 1: 2:25

Yes, finally, because it's a podcast idea Okay. There are not a lot of podcast ideas out there, so this will be good, this will be nice, yeah, so what if we just sit around and banter and we're like two comedians? This is a totally new idea for a podcast Unfiltered right. We're going to talk about anything.

Speaker 2: 2:45

This conversation could go anywhere.

Speaker 1: 2:49

We could talk about pizza. I will talk about pizza. You do? You love pizza? I?

Speaker 2: 2:57

do we have to have some pizza next time? I'm not against it. Are you into cold breakfast pizza? Yes, I'll do Me too.

Speaker 1: 3:05

Wait, when you say breakfast pizza, are you talking about pizza with eggs and bacon? I wasn't, but now I am. That's okay too. Just regular pizza, cold and eating for breakfast.

Speaker 2: 3:15

I just mean pizza from the night before. I'm in favor. Have you ever had breakfast? The other one, the breakfast pizza that actually has eggs on it.

Speaker 1: 3:23

I feel like I might have in the course of my life. Maybe that's come up, but I don't know.

Speaker 2: 3:28

Okay, Tell me the weirdest pizza you've ever had. The weirdest pizza topping.

Speaker 1: 3:32

I mean, when I went to England for the first time and they put corn on a pizza, I was like, wait a second, what? Now? Total convert, I will put corn. I ate pizza last night and put corn on it myself and I'm happy with it. The other thing is when I went to Japan, they love to take a pizza and then kind of drizzle a squiggly line of mayonnaise across the entire pizza. Oh yeah, that's a big thing in Japan that you have to either watch out for and say, okay, now don't mayonnaise my pizza please, but people love it there. I haven't adopted that. I don't do that.

Speaker 2: 4:09

You haven't converted no Corn. Yes, I haven't put two and two together, corn and mayonnaise.

Speaker 1: 4:13

I have not, although Japan also liked to corn on a pizza situation. So how?

Speaker 2: 4:17

are you? What is your opinion on tuna fish on pizza?

Speaker 1: 4:21

That's what Germans do. It seems tricky, but okay, let's try it out.

Speaker 2: 4:25

It actually is pretty good. It sounds gross, but it's actually pretty good. It's like a tuna melt.

Speaker 1: 4:31

Yeah, it's like a salty sort of yeah with bread.

Speaker 2: 4:34

It's really just a tuna melt. It tastes pretty good. Okay, my weirdest one that I think sticks with me in Wisconsin Wisconsin. I don't know if you know, but Wisconsin is actually famous for really weird pizzas. Oh, so we have weird pizza toppings.

Speaker 1: 4:48

I did not know that. Into that. Okay, it's a normal thing. Lay it on me.

Speaker 2: 4:52

Like New York pizzas, like thin and it's got pepperoni.

Speaker 1: 4:54

It's classic Italian Chicago pizza is deep, yeah, chicago's deep, the deep dish.

Speaker 2: 4:59

Yeah, it's got stuff in it.

Speaker 1: 5:00

Those are the only two types of pizza. Oh, detroit pizza, I now have learned, is square Square.

Speaker 2: 5:06

It's really rude since they're all about automotive.

Speaker 1: 5:08

You know, like wheels and stuff, that they were like our pizzas are square, though you know like, okay, our pizzas are also cars.

Speaker 2: 5:14

Yeah, so so Wisconsin pizzas are like hokey. They're like hokey, weird things on the pizza. Okay, but anyway. So there's this place called Glass Ninkle Pizza in Madison, wisconsin, that has really weird ones, like cordon blue pizza, which is actually pretty good.

Speaker 1: 5:29

And they also have like chicken and ham and cheese yeah, and chicken cheese, yeah.

Speaker 2: 5:33

And then they also have like um, they have like, they have one that's called the feta licious, which is just like feta and like Greek kind of style, All of us in feta and stuff and it's really good, but it's like but though, there's another place that's called Ian's Pizza. That's downtown and it's a and actually it's all over now, but they have one that's macaroni and cheese pizza.

Speaker 1: 5:55

Oh man, this is already in the title alone. I mean, yeah, yeah, it's really good.

Speaker 2: 6:01

And that sort of sticks me with me as kind of the weirdest pizza Okay.

Speaker 1: 6:04

Yeah, I had one at a party in San Francisco years ago that had pears on the like really thin sliced pear on the pizza. I think the cheese was either like a gorgonzola or a goat cheese or some other kind of cheese, but it was this was a bougie pizza. It was, it was a bougie pizza and it was at a weird house party, but it was very delicious I was. I remember it to this day. This was probably 10 years ago at least, but I remember.

Speaker 2: 6:29

By weird house party in. San Francisco you mean a swingers party, right? So?

Speaker 1: 6:32

that was pizza. I don't, it was.

Speaker 2: 6:34

Everyone was naked eating pear pizza with gorgonzola.

Speaker 1: 6:36

I don't even remember how I came to go to this, because I don't go to parties and certain you know like. I don't remember the circumstances. I think it was a friend of a friend or something, but they were like a weird pizza party and maybe that's what drew me in, is that I was going to try a bunch of different types of pizza. So that's how to trick me into your house party if you want to trap me.

Speaker 2: 6:57

So so. So here's the idea. So the idea is what I call asynchronous podcasting or an asynchronous podcast. Okay, and we can do it. I think we'll even do it in this episode. So we'll stop early, Like we'll talk about the solution a little bit, but then we'll stop early and I think we'll try to actually do it in here. Yeah, or maybe, or if we talk longer, we could do like the next episode and they'll come out together two episodes this episode and then the next one.

Speaker 1: 7:25

Maybe is asynchronous and it's its own. Let's see how it goes. And we'll see how it goes, and then it's asynchronous. You're saying not, not at the same time, is that? Am I decoding that correctly?

Speaker 2: 7:35

Yeah, yeah. So it means like yeah, it's like, it's like texting instead of a phone call. Like you know, I get to say something and then it sits and then you get to read it on your own time, and once you've read it, you can think and then decide on your own time to respond, Right?

Speaker 1: 7:50

Instead of a chat message where I see the. I see you like responding in real time.

Speaker 2: 7:55

We're talking, yeah, we're talking about, like, this conversation we're talking about this is synchronous, because, like, we're both hearing and talking at the same time, right? So, yeah, so the. So, right now for the podcast we're recording, we always get together in my house or we get together or on zoom and we're recording at the same time Synchronous. But I was thinking, well, why not have it just be like asynchronous, where I can be recording a podcast just by responding and then? And then the case maybe, maybe there'd be some like hot back and forth where we are kind of responding very quickly back and forth, but but then otherwise it might be like, oh, it might be an hour or a day later, where then I respond and then you respond.

Speaker 1: 8:32

I was going to say. Is this your way of telling me that I interrupt you too much and that this would be a way around where you would never have to worry about me cutting in? I finally get to finish a thought for once.

Speaker 2: 8:42

I mean, I thought it was the other way around. I thought I was interrupting you too much.

Speaker 1: 8:45

Well, no, absolutely you do.

Speaker 2: 8:47

So I'm thankful for that. I'm solving my own problem here. You don't have a genius, I would have spit out if you hadn't cut me off just then.

Speaker 1: 8:55

Oh man, I'm so smart.

Speaker 2: 8:58

Your right, interruption is a problem, but this is more like just I don't know, that's the yeah, this is more like one where I don't know what the outcome will be. But if we can, if it's a new modality, it's a new possibility. And a lot of other media is asynchronous, like Slack and text messaging, and they're super popular. Those are like the most popular kinds of communication. Yeah, but podcasting is the only synchronous and actually I was having a really hard time even kind of figuring out how to implement this, like with the technology. Yeah, like there isn't really any way to just be like bam bam, bam, bam bam and then have it just like output very cleanly into like a single back-to-back audio situation.

Speaker 1: 9:41

It seems like you would have to do one what each response separately and then stitch them together afterward, which?

Speaker 2: 9:47

maybe the way we do it, or if we discover a different way.

Speaker 1: 9:50

We'll have to talk about that. Here's what I'm worried about, though. If I say a really funny joke, are you gonna record yourself laughing, or do you just skip that part and then?

Speaker 2: 9:59

it's just dead. We can put. If we produce it, we could put a laugh track in.

Speaker 1: 10:05

Oh perfect, people laugh. I just get one recording of you going ha, ha ha and then I put that in whenever I think that I've made a good joke. I have, I just slot in your laugh track, so that makes sense no, we can laugh right at you.

Speaker 2: 10:18

So if you said something really funny and you sent it and I could start my recording and be like that is really funny, ha ha ha. You know, and then continue, you know, but it's gonna sound weird. My worry is that it's gonna sound really choppy and unnatural to listen through, to listen to it through.

Speaker 1: 10:35

Like it may be just a series of voicemails instead of an actual conversation. That's what I think it will be actually.

Speaker 2: 10:42

Well, I mean we're professional but we'll see. We'll see because we're gonna be the first people to ever do it.

Speaker 1: 10:47

And we may be the last people to ever do it and discover exactly why it's not a thing that's done.

Speaker 2: 10:53

But that's our job.

Speaker 1: 10:54

We gotta figure these things out, right.

Speaker 2: 10:57

We're on the very forefront. This is like Union Square. Okay, how could it be? You know, how was it ever? Maybe this will be the new way all podcasts are recorded, because it is much more, it's much easier to do, right? Because you don't have to meet, you don't have to be like you know, and you can think very thoughtfully about what the person last said and have these like really nice then full sort of fledged responses.

Speaker 1: 11:19

The podcast version of you know writing letters. You know, like, dearest Adam, how do the days treat you? It has been many weeks since we last communicated, and in the interim I have had many occurrences from which I now shall share. Wait, do I have to talk all the way down?

Speaker 2: 11:42

Like civil war letters. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, I do it. You know, what I hate is and this is neither here nor there, but when someone says you know, when you're in school, and sometimes the teacher would be like, would just like randomly say like that's, they'd be like Johnny, just stay after class a little bit, I need to ask you something or I need to talk.

Speaker 2: 12:05

Okay, everyone would go, ooh, right, that's what everyone would do, right and even now the same thing happens, Like if your boss is like, oh, I put a time to talk, like next week on Tuesday at 4pm, You're like, oh no, you just have anxiety. I just have like anxiety all the way through to that meeting. And then they're like oh, I just wanted to talk to you about this thing. I have no idea. You know, I assume I'm in trouble. It's the same thing with your partner. That's why I was thinking about it, cause the text. If someone texts you, we need to talk.

Speaker 1: 12:38

Yeah, oh, my God just of course you have a wall of anxiety until the talk actually happens, right Okay.

Speaker 2: 12:47

So maybe we should have like semaphores with messages like that Wait, like, what is this? What are semaphores A stoplight red, green, yellow.

Speaker 1: 12:55

Okay, how why, was I thinking. Semaphore was people on ships with flags communicating to other ships, maybe it is, maybe there's both.

Speaker 2: 13:05

I mean definitely it's stoplights, okay, but it might also be flag communication.

Speaker 1: 13:09

Do you know what I'm talking about? The thing where they uh-huh, uh-huh, Holding different flags, different angles.

Speaker 2: 13:16

Right, anyways, I think maybe it's both, but anyways, red, green, yellow, that's the common semaphore, the stoplight, you know. And so people could be like we need to talk red. And then you're like, oh shit. And then you're like you don't have to, in a way you don't even. You would have left the anxiety even then, cause you'd be like, oh, it's something bad, I need to like prepare myself. But if it was like we need to talk green, it's like, oh cool, we need to talk. They're going to like compliment me or like give me a present or something, right?

Speaker 1: 13:44

You said it with a-.

Speaker 2: 13:45

Or we need to talk yellow. It's like, probably you need to figure something out, like I have a question for you. I don't really know if it's good or bad, but I need to ask you something that's important. And then you could be like oh, they want to know, they want my help, they want to connect with me and figure something out. We should definitely have that.

Speaker 1: 14:00

That should become the new consensus I send someone in Texas as we need to talk within a thumbs down emoji and they're like oh no, oh, this is not a good one. Or the thumbs up emoji, I don't thumbs down.

Speaker 2: 14:11

Well, that's just one I would do. Red, yellow, green, green is this is going to be a good conversation. I'm complimenting you, I'm positive. Red is like I've got a beef. This is a problem. And yellow is like I don't know if I have a beef, but I might. I need to ask you about something that happened or something and kind of get your, because then you know.

Speaker 1: 14:29

So yellow and red would still produce a lot of anxiety, but green you'd be like good. What did they do? What?

Speaker 2: 14:34

did they do? If someone said like we need to talk red, I wouldn't feel anxiety so much as because anxiety comes from not knowing, I would be like, just be like oh dang. Okay, they're mad about something. Okay, I wonder what they're mad about. I'm ready to like hear them, I'm ready to like apologize, or I'm ready to you know.

Speaker 1: 14:54

I don't know, I don't know what it is, but I'm ready to apologize, yeah yeah, I would have less anxiety, but I would still have some anxiety from that.

Speaker 2: 15:03

but that would definitely be an improvement.

Speaker 1: 15:05

But you're saying that green would be nice, but that's asynchronous communication.

Speaker 2: 15:07

Yeah, so there's green would be nice though, like if I'm like Scott, we need to talk tomorrow. Green, you're like, adam's gonna give me a present. You know, adam's gonna tell me how great I am, or something you know.

Speaker 1: 15:19

So for our asynchronous podcast, you would be like Scott, I have a solution, red and I'd be like oh no, You're in trouble.

Speaker 2: 15:26

Scott, I'm gonna criticize you.

Speaker 1: 15:28

No, but if you go, I have a solution. Green, I'm like all right, I'm ready to go, let's go. What are we talking? Pizza?

Speaker 2: 15:33

Yeah, anything that's gonna be like, cause people are causing each other all this unnecessary anxiety. With a little bit of extra signaling we could eliminate a large portion of that, and our society is already so full of anxiety, you know yes that absolutely. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 15:52

Yeah, texting does seem to lack nuance and get misconstrued easily, more easily. Well, cause you're? You don't have the tone of voice, you're not putting tone in it, you're not putting your cadence. If you're talking with like a very quickly talking, aggressive or whatever, or if you're just very relaxed talking, it's all the same, right? I mean, there's a good key and peel sketch where they're texting each other back and forth.

Speaker 2: 16:21

And one guy is texting very calmly like yo we can hang out whatever.

Speaker 1: 16:26

And the other guy's reading it with the least generous interpretation possible and getting fired up. We can hang out whatever. Yeah, I remember that sketch, yup yup. And it's a great example of how that can go wrong.

Speaker 2: 16:41

Yeah, but and also I mean this is not too far outside of the realm of possibility. I mean, then you could just add the emoji like the red circle, the yellow circle, the green circle. But even Apple added the like tap back feature. You probably don't know that.

Speaker 1: 16:55

I don't know this. I'm not an Apple guy.

Speaker 2: 16:56

You're a green text man, I'm a blue text man.

Speaker 1: 17:00

All texts look the same to me.

Speaker 2: 17:02

I'm an equal.

Speaker 1: 17:03

I'm an equal equal larian. Equal larian, equal larian.

Speaker 2: 17:07

Equivalent, equal, equalitarian. Yes, so with Apple, if I'm talking to another person with an Apple, if they're both blue text boys, then I can tap on what they said and I can add like this little, like emoji response, like a heart or a thumbs up or a laugh or like an exclamation point If I was sending the text, you could actually maybe there'd be like a keyboard, like a thing, where it's like send this text with like an aura, like give the text an aura, an aura.

Speaker 1: 17:37

Like an aura around it.

Speaker 2: 17:39

Like a green aura, or like a red aura, or like a yellow aura, and then you would know.

Speaker 1: 17:45

You would know, or an ironical aura, I don't know, is this one that you would attach yourself, or would it have to do semantic analysis to figure out?

Speaker 2: 17:56

No, no, you could just say, purple aura for irony or sarcasm, green aura for, like, positive, warm buzzies. I don't know. I guess sort of what emojis do, but anyways, this is neither here nor there. I'm getting totally dragged off, but we're talking about asynchronous communication, but so maybe we should okay. So let's plan. So we're gonna do this, maybe as another episode, maybe as this episode either way, these go together this one and that one, the idea, and then the execution of that idea.

Speaker 2: 18:26

good or bad, however it turns out we record afterwards to say what we maybe we should record afterwards to and critique it. How did it go? Sure Pros and cons, and then that whole thing might be one episode, or maybe it's three episodes that are released all in the same day. We have flexibility. We'll try it. Should we wrap up this?

Speaker 1: 18:46

We'll wrap up this portion. The next thing you hear either on this episode or in this feed would be the results of what we make yeah okay, great thanks, I like the idea. Thanks for joining us. If this is the end of the episode or not, if it's the middle of the episode, I mean the listener actually knows more than we do at this point because they can look at the run time of the file that they downloaded. So they'll know we're sitting here going. I wonder what we're gonna do.

Speaker 2: 19:12

And they're like I already know what you're gonna do. Get on with it. Okay, we'll get on with it, See you in a little bit everyone, bye, bye. ["the Last Episode"].

Speaker 1: 19:25

All right, welcome back everybody. This is Scott. You are now inside the episode. Inside the episode I should play like an inception sound. Maybe I'll do that right here. ["the Last Episode"]. But welcome back. We are now doing the experimented episode. I say we even though I'm here by myself. I've come down to Texas to visit my parents and Adam is back in California not anywhere near, as we haven't coordinated this at all. This is the heart of the asynchronous episode where I talk into the microphone by myself, send it to him. He talks and sends it back. We'll see how long this will take and how disjointed or jointed it'll seem, but we're kicking it off. Welcome back. I hope you're enjoying this and I hope we get something good. All right, adam, what do you gotta say?

Speaker 2: 20:13

That's so interesting. So there's like a couple of different ways to say it. Well, hey, OK, well, kicking off, yeah, thanks everybody for hanging with us as we do this little experiment in asynchronous podcasting. I guess, yeah, we can address each other, we can address the audience. It's just like the podcast, but it's just done. Yeah, not synchronously. I don't get it. It's so simple, but maybe it'll turn out to be something interesting. Let's see. I wonder what the kind of pros and cons are to this format as we start to explore it.

Speaker 1: 20:47

Well, classically, you know, everyone's biggest complaint about podcasting besides that there aren't enough of them is that it sounds like it flows. The conversation flows too easily. I wish it would just sound more stutter-stepped, like you guys weren't in the same spot and you had to respond like a walkie-talkie more less than a telephone. So you know, if this takes off, we can maybe sell people on walkie-talkies to replace cell phones, so that we could just kind of move asynchronous communication all the way into other corners of everyone's life.

Speaker 2: 21:21

So you joke. But look at the history of text messaging, right, Text messaging has exploded and email totally exploded. I mean, that's probably the way most people do most of their communication is text message and email totally asynchronous. And now the emergence of Slack, totally asynchronous. So I mean, it's true, you do want you're right, though obviously podcasting.

Speaker 2: 21:49

No one ever said, boy, I really wish this was more sort of awkward and stutter-stop, but yeah, asynchronous podcasting. I'm starting to notice that I get to think more about what we're talking about and think more about what I'm gonna say, because there's so much time in between when you speak and then when I speak and I can listen back to what you said before or what I said before before I message again. So that maybe makes it more thoughtful and maybe even more could be in other podcasts not this podcast, but it could be more researched in another podcast that was more focused on, you know, sort of facts and science and stuff. We're just out there coming up with new wacky ideas, but yeah, so there, I think there are some, I think it could take off.

Speaker 1: 22:37

Interesting because I almost feel like I have too much time to think, like I'm at risk of overthinking what I'm gonna say, or I will try to completely plan out what I'm gonna say ahead of time and then feel like I'm reciting the things that I wrote in my head instead of just kind of going off the cuff and winging it. So maybe we're just two different types of thinkers, but I feel like maybe I have too much time now, but it's definitely interesting. I mean, it's nice to be able to just jump in for a minute here or a minute there whenever I have time, especially right now. It's for everyone listening. Right now it's holiday time, tomorrow is Thanksgiving and so there's a lot going on. I'm down at my family's house and just the time to sit there and record like a two hour podcast would not exist.

Speaker 1: 23:23

So being able to just jump in for a minute is it does have its advantages, I'll admit it, but I don't know, it feels weird. I feel like I'm overthinking my comments or overthinking what I'm gonna say, and I mean actually even more than that. I noticed my tendency to want to be hyper perfectionist and want to erase what I just recorded and then re-record it, but with slightly different words or slightly different intonation or whatever. Instead of it's the same part of me. That's not good at playing a video game and just being okay, like I wanna reset as soon as I mess up, so that I'm just doing the same part over and over again and not really. I'm not a video game guy. This is why.

Speaker 2: 24:10

Okay. So we have some cons, which is that it's kind of awkward, but we have some pros, which is that maybe you get some more time to think. So it's got some pros and cons. Yeah, I guess maybe this is also. Like you know, the flight at Kitty Hawk, right Like this, is like the fur.

Speaker 2: 24:27

I've never heard of an of an asynchronous podcast. So this is sort of like the first flight. Who knows, maybe other groups or people can do it better or do it differently and and and see what happens. But I think it's. I think it's a pretty interesting thing. Is it a solution to any problem? Not really. I'm finding that I'm listening to everything we said and then speaking. So it's actually taking like extremely a long, a much, much longer time to do than if we just sit down and do it and, you know, talk straight out. So yeah, maybe that's another con, but it's also. It's also still pretty interesting, especially because we're we're trying to have an episode about asynchronous podcasting. But what if it was like an episode done asynchronously but about some other topic? Would that be different too? Maybe we'd have, maybe we should propose a secondary topic or something.

Speaker 1: 25:25

Okay, here's a secondary topic then. It's winter now and a lot of places that means cold weather, snow, ice, All sorts of inclement unfriendly things for being outside. You and I live in the Bay Area. It's not so bad, you know, it gets a little chilly, but that's about it. But we've both lived in places where it gets way worse than that. And as a proponent of bikes, this is where.

Speaker 1: 25:48

I see cars and you know vehicles like that come in very handy, both for having enclosed spaces to protect you from sliding around and also warm spaces to you know, fight that weather situation. But as a proponent of pikes, what would you? Do when it's you know I see snowy situation like. Is there a bike based alternative for that? Do you put like chains on your tires or what is there other than just getting out and walking and bubbling up and all sorts of winter?

Speaker 2: 26:22

clothing.

Speaker 1: 26:23

Is there an option? I mean, is it jet skis, not jet skis, snowmobiles, Is it snowmobiles or what I mean? What do you got? What kind of things would you use in that situation?

Speaker 2: 26:36

So are you asking for like a solution from the multiverse or just sort of the pragmatic answer? I think bike snowmobiles, right. So you bike and there's like a tread on the back, like a big fat tread. No, I'm just kidding, I think you know Madison, wisconsin, where I'm from, is extremely, an extremely cold place is in Wisconsin and they have bike paths and they, they plow the bike paths when it snows. There's, there's budget just for, like there's a huge, multi tens of millions of dollars budget to plow the roads. There's a tiny, you know, $200,000 budget or whatever to plow all the bike paths every morning if it snows. So, yeah, it snows and then it's, you can still bike on it and people might think, oh, that's really cold or that's really whatever. But if you wear, if you wear some gloves and then you get on your bike and you have something to protect against the wind, you actually warm up really fast just from biking and it feels really good because you're not sweaty when you get somewhere, because you're you're being cooled by the air as you go. So I mean, I think, I think you shouldn't, you know, we shouldn't let perfection be the enemy of the good.

Speaker 2: 27:45

So yeah, all of California, all of the Southwest, all of the South. You know they all. You know Hawaii, all these places can use bikes 100% of the time. And then in the in the Northwest and the East Coast, they can use bikes 70% of the time, and in the Midwest you can use them maybe 60 or 70% of the time. During the winter, okay, maybe fewer people are going to bike, but then that's why you have multimodal transit. Bikes are just one mode of transportation. I would not say that I'm a pro, totally fanatically pro, bicycle. I would just say that I'm. I think bikes are the fastest way by. Protected bike lanes are the fastest way to a sensible relationship with cars. So yeah, that's an answer. What do you think of that? Take that, stick that in your pipe and smoke it. Haha.

Speaker 1: 28:35

Okay, fair enough. Another thing, jumping back out to the podcast, about the podcast situation, one thing I'm noticing is that I mean, my last comment was recorded late at night and I was, you know, I'm at my parents house so I'm trying to be quiet, you can tell. The thing I'm noticing is that I come to each of these segments with wildly different energy, or it's possible that I could jump in with wildly different energy from point to point, which is something you don't contend with with a synchronous podcast, with a, with a usual podcast, when we're talking, if I'm up or if I'm down or whatever it's, it's a consistent level of energy throughout. And here, depending on the time of day, depending on the circumstances, how I'm feeling, whatever, I might jump in for my comment with low energy, I might jump in with extra high energy. I might have to be quiet because I'm trying not to wake anyone up or whatever, or I could be loud and boisterous. It's really all over the map and I think kind of contributes to the disjointed feeling or whatever.

Speaker 1: 29:40

What have you about? I think it. I don't think it aids the listening experience, if that makes sense. I don't think it helps out in that respect, even though it may be more convenient for us as hosts, which you're saying. You've listened to the whole thing over and over again. I don't know if it's even more convenient for us, but I think that's a part that I wanted to take note of, because I'm noticing that as I listen back as well.

Speaker 2: 30:04

Yeah, I think you're right. That's another good observation the difference in energy. Yeah, I think I mean this is a good experiment, because I've never heard of anyone doing this, but maybe no one's done it, because they found exactly what we're finding, which is that it's not as fun certainly is like sitting down in real time and like having a conversation, and then it has these kind of kind of costs and, you know, these kinds of cons, and the pros don't really stack up, and then the final product it doesn't isn't as, maybe as good either. So, yeah, yeah, but this is it's still an interesting experiment, though.

Speaker 1: 30:43

You know, adam, that's actually a really good thing. I wasn't even thinking about was the fun aspect of it. And you're right, it's not like it's not. I'm, I was focused on the connectivity because it doesn't feel like we're as connected. But there is also a. You know, it kind of sapped some of the fun out of the conversation and I think that does translate into the product.

Speaker 1: 31:04

But also, you know, like, when I'm thinking about asynchronous communication, a lot of times it's for productivity, for doing things on people's own schedules and things, and that's sort of the antithesis of what you're doing when you're podcasting. You want connectivity but you want to have fun in the conversation. I think the only place where that not the only place I haven't considered everything, but what I was thinking about is the place where fun comes in. With asynchronous is kind of like on a back and forth. If you're flirting with someone or or having that sort of witty repartee thing where you're, you know, the pause in between, the anticipation for the response is part of it, and that happens with flirting. But a lot of times when we're texting or emailing or doing things that are asynchronous, it's for productivity and you're not angling it toward a fun experience or toward something where you're like, yeah, this is geared toward fun, and that is absolutely true, it's really. It really is different when we're doing it like this than when we're just going back and forth and riffing or whatever.

Speaker 1: 32:14

Yeah, that's a. That's a good point I hadn't even considered. But well, it is a good thing to try out and it's an interesting experiment, and maybe we're, maybe maybe it's about time to wrap up this version of it. We'll come back and we can wrap up things together or not, but yeah, that's that's a thing. I think we're exploring it and we're finding out the strengths and weaknesses of it and evaluating it. I mean, we're not going to revolutionize podcasting with this, with with this discovery or with this process, but you know, it's something to consider. It certainly is interesting to try out the technology and to think about podcasting in a different way. I find that to be a valuable experiment nonetheless. So, all right, what do you think? You got a, got a way to wrap us up here, sir? Let's, let's hear it.

Speaker 2: 33:05

Yeah, I think you're ready to wrap up on the async side. I think it was cool because you you did a we I tried to say let's use WhatsApp and like just send messages back and forth, and you were like I can find a better thing. And you just like went into like the belly depths of the Internet and found this app sound trap that we've been using and it's been pretty cool. I mean, I wonder if you know, when you, when you try experiments like this, where you when new ideas I mean I put in bigger, bigger kind of solutions from the multiverse context here, when you try completely new ideas, there's like splash effects. It's almost like when you, when NASA like tries to send a man to the moon, you know they, they also invent like new toothbrush heads or whatever. You know. Like you get this splash effect when you try and when you explore completely new ideas.

Speaker 2: 33:55

And so completely new ideas are a good part of a culture, you know, of a company, of a country, of a university, of whatever, of a family, and so anyways, yeah, I think this is kind of an example of that is like we're we're really learning about this, about the medium, and we're learning about the technology that's possible to use, all just because we had the sort of wackiness or or kind of commitment to try completely new ideas. So, hey, there's a little, there's a little shout out to the value of being in somebody being a solution or being an SFM or who values completely new ideas, which is kind of the ethos of the podcast. So, yeah, okay, cool, well, yeah, let's, yeah, we'll, we'll circle back and we'll record some more in person and see and see kind of kind of sync up and feel the difference, feel the contrast between the async and the synchronous podcasting. So, thanks everybody for hanging with us as we try this little experiment.

Speaker 1: 35:06

I just got back from my trip, but yeah when I was on my trip, we, over the course of like a week, several days, we recorded a but that podcast chunk you just heard, and we did it asynchronously. So, yeah, it was completely. What did you think of it? I was, I was.

Speaker 2: 35:23

I was. I was disappointed because I thought it would be like this. I thought it would have, like the, the kind of convenience of like texting or the convenience of like using Slack or email. But it just didn't have that convenience. It was very like jerky and sluggish and like I had to review by listening to like what was said and then, like, when I heard us through, it was like very yeah, disjointed and weird.

Speaker 1: 35:50

It would the energy did go, that bounced up and down, which? We acknowledge like during it.

Speaker 2: 35:55

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 35:57

And I it wasn't. Yeah, the more convenient part you lose when you have to kind of backtrack and look at everything and be like oh right, catch my brain up to where was the conversation before? That it's not like, I guess, because with audio you can't skim the messages above. You have to listen to them at speed or at whatever, right.

Speaker 2: 36:17

Also, you're saying such in-depth things that it's not just a text message like hey, where are you at? I'm here, oh there.

Speaker 1: 36:26

It's easy to remember what's being said Right when you're looking at a text thread you're seeing.

Speaker 2: 36:32

I mean you can't help it.

Speaker 1: 36:33

Read the message right above and it triggers you back into that.

Speaker 2: 36:36

Unless you have a beeper, like me. I just have a beeper, so I can only see the last text. What? Really? I just have a beeper. Yeah, it's on my belt.

Speaker 1: 36:43

Oh, that's really handy. That's cool. Yeah, you can. That way you know if you have a phone from your, a call from your landline. That's right.

Speaker 2: 36:49

That's right. I can no, but you're right, you're right, it's, it's, it's texting and even email. You might say more in-depth things, but you kind of don't reference five emails ago. Usually, you know, you pretty much just reference like what they just said.

Speaker 1: 37:03

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 37:03

You respond with whatever it is. So yeah, it was, it was definitely. I think it was. No, maybe maybe people maybe listening back to it, maybe maybe we'll have different opinions, but right now, from having had to do it, I mean it'll edit together a little more smoothly, but I think still, it's going to be, it's going to be very well.

Speaker 1: 37:19

It'll be noticeably different up and down, like energy-wise.

Speaker 2: 37:22

And I think it makes a big difference when you're editing whether, like, as one person finishes speaking, you like have the other person kind of begin speaking, as if they were kind of like in the same room, if they're like fully apart. So there's like a teeny half quarter second of dead air between the two, I think that's going to make it sound really disjointed.

Speaker 2: 37:42

There's a guy on YouTube who does these screen rants where he like makes fun of movies. Do you ever watch that guy? Nope, it's really good. I recommend it. He, he like, points out basically all the plot holes in movies.

Speaker 1: 37:52

in this really funny way I may have, is it just called screen rant.

Speaker 2: 37:55

Yeah, I may have seen it.

Speaker 1: 37:56

Yeah, it's a guy and it's just back and forth, and it's him playing writer and producer.

Speaker 2: 38:02

It's like a really stupid producer with a really stupid writer and they're like you got it. He always starts off, so you got another movie for me. And then the writers like, okay, I don't think I, okay, I don't think I have to say this yes, I do, sir, and then they go into it and it's really funny.

Speaker 2: 38:15

I mean, if you go back like four years ago when he was developing the concept, he's like more stilted, but if you watch the ones he's done recently, they're so funny, it's really good Anyways, but he has it like really edited close. Well, he even says in like a how did I make that? Like he kind of reveals his whole process, just as a YouTuber, and he's like. At first I had them like like like where one guy finished speaking and then the other guy started speaking after and it sounded like totally stilted, stilted Right, and all I did was go and just put them so that, as the other person finished speaking before they cut away from that view of them, you hear the other guy speaking and then it cuts to the hymn in video.

Speaker 2: 38:58

And so that made it feel like they were in the same room having a conversation, whereas if the audio was always the same for who was like you were looking at, then it sounded really fake. So I don't know, maybe there's something in editing that does it, I don't know.

Speaker 1: 39:10

I used to listen to a radio show called the Phil Hendry show. The Phil Hendry show, and what it was was the host, phil. He was interviewing a weird caller who had some like outrageous viewpoint and he would be like civil at first, and then they would start arguing and like yelling at each other and like cutting each other off and interrupting, and then it would be so incendiary.

Speaker 2: 39:35

Just like this podcast. Well, it would be so incendiary.

Speaker 1: 39:37

No, just like this podcast that callers would call in to argue with the guest.

Speaker 2: 39:43

Okay.

Speaker 1: 39:43

And the trick is that Phil was both the host and the guest every time he was doing a voice and hitting a button that would like change his voice over between phone voice and radio voice. Wow, and he was arguing with himself and he was so good at cutting himself off and like changing between the two personas it was flawless and he would trick new, because every caller was a new caller who hadn't figured out that that was what was going on. And they're arguing with a persona who had wild ideas which are insane, yeah, and it's just.

Speaker 1: 40:17

The entertainment is for the rest of the audience. Who knows what the bid is?

Speaker 2: 40:19

So you're saying that this guy's so talented, he can do that, but we can't even make it sound like we're in the same room together. No, I'm saying he's so not talented. No, he's doing the opposite of what we were doing.

Speaker 1: 40:30

Which is he?

Speaker 2: 40:30

was creating more than one person.

Speaker 1: 40:33

Yeah, more than one of himself in the same area at the same time. Oh perfect, we were spreading out time and space.

Speaker 2: 40:39

It also was really demanding, like every now and then you'd be like. I messaged you it's your turn, it's your turn, it's your turn. And I would be like I'm having a panic attack.

Speaker 1: 40:47

It's like bugging someone to play a game of chess, yeah, and we were like that was annoying too, not that?

Speaker 2: 40:51

you personally, but the model itself inspired that kind of behavior and so it was bad. And it'd be like 9 pm and I'd be like in bed and I'd be like, oh, I guess I should do this work, and it was totally misplaced. You know. So yeah, I definitely think it was like maybe just like email and text and Slack it like the work, like invades our lives through those channels.

Speaker 1: 41:10

Well then you're like now. Now I didn't create myself a podcast where I can do it at a small amount of time.

Speaker 2: 41:16

It's now it never, all the time, it never becomes a to do podcast.

Speaker 1: 41:21

There's no end point where I can go done.

Speaker 2: 41:24

Put it in the box. That's bad. Put it in the box, yeah, okay. Well, thanks everybody for going on that experiment with us.

Speaker 1: 41:31

I mean, you have to try new models and now if it does get like famous in the future and someone else figures it out. We are at the top part of that Wikipedia article meaning, like before the famous version, these two young men in the Bay.

Speaker 2: 41:45

Area tried a secret Too deeply confused.

Speaker 1: 41:48

An ill-fated attempt was had in the year 2023.

Speaker 2: 41:54

Now, in 2050, when they finally Old timey, yes, oh, very August, very old timey.

Speaker 1: 42:01

Welcome to Ye Old Wikipedia. Which article shall we give to your private? It's today.

Speaker 2: 42:09

Excellent, you have chosen random. Have you used the random feature?

Speaker 1: 42:13

No, it's so fun. What kind of psycho is going random on Wikipedia? It's fun.

Speaker 2: 42:17

You press random and it just you click random and it gives you a totally random article on Wikipedia. You just learn something. When you usually like this is a province in Australia or something.

Speaker 1: 42:28

Hold on when you Google something. Are you the guy that uses the I'm feeling lucky button?

Speaker 2: 42:32

Every time no, I'm always feeling lucky. I've never clicked that button. I should become a gambler.

Speaker 1: 42:37

What does that just serve you up?

Speaker 2: 42:38

one result it serves up the top result. Oh, that's kind of boring.

Speaker 1: 42:41

I thought if you do that you don't see any ads.

Speaker 2: 42:45

Anti-capitalist button.

Speaker 1: 42:46

I have ad blockers. I don't see any ads, you don't see.

Speaker 2: 42:48

Google ads. No, oh, that's interesting. My ad blocker still lets me see Google ads Well probably because different ad blockers.

Speaker 1: 42:55

I'd like to I actually talk to you off mic. I'd like to see Google ads. Oh well then maybe you're not blocking them on purpose.

Speaker 2: 43:01

I don't mind sponsored. I mean, yeah, I don't mind, that's cool. Somebody like wants me to see those, they might be right.

Speaker 1: 43:07

So you're going to Wikipedia, you're hitting random. What kind of stuff are you going to find?

Speaker 2: 43:11

It's actually pretty boring. It's usually like really really, but sometimes that's the thing.

Speaker 1: 43:16

Geographical feature.

Speaker 2: 43:16

Yeah, it's like something or like some extremely minor person in history, like extremely minor, not important person, but they wrote a little Wikipedia page about them, yeah, but it is fun because in every 10th one you actually find like whoa, I would never, ever known that, like in this weird place, at this weird time, this weird thing happened, you know. So it's pretty good, that's fine.

Speaker 1: 43:41

But we should wrap up.

Speaker 2: 43:43

Thanks everybody for listening and riding along with this wild rhyme.

Speaker 1: 43:47

Stick tuned to next week, where we will have a completely synchronous podcast. Back to the back to the ways of old.

Speaker 2: 43:54

Ye olde podcast.

Speaker 1: 43:56

Thanks everybody.

Speaker 2: 43:57

Bye.